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  • Compulsory nerve check?

    Just wanted an official answer really on this as we've played it a certain way since we started but never read anything official on it: If a unit without a wavering value suffers a wound but their nerve is higher than 12, is a nerve check still 'taken'? Just wanting to know in reference to Elohi and their Iron Resolve rule. They get a point back if they pass a check, but is the check ever actually made if it wouldn't be able to rout them?

  • #2
    If one has the potential to waiver and a waiver would impact the game, then yes due to double 6 being a waiver. In even tournament play, we are often not rolling for nerve if there is no point and it is a waste of time on fearless units (units with no waiver value and not subject to waiver).

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    • #3
      Originally posted by MooseJuice View Post
      Just wanted an official answer really on this as we've played it a certain way since we started but never read anything official on it: If a unit without a wavering value suffers a wound but their nerve is higher than 12, is a nerve check still 'taken'? Just wanting to know in reference to Elohi and their Iron Resolve rule. They get a point back if they pass a check, but is the check ever actually made if it wouldn't be able to rout them?
      It is still technically made, however they will automatically pass and trigger the iron resolve rule

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Daedle View Post

        It is still technically made, however they will automatically pass and trigger the iron resolve rule
        Lovely. That's all I needed to hear! Thanks very much

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Daedle View Post
          It is still technically made, however they will automatically pass and trigger the iron resolve rule
          I am assuming this means that either the roll is not actually made but just presumed to have happened thus automatically returning the point of damage OR that the nerve roll has to be made regardless even though it cannot possibly succeed (with the effect being that the point of damage is negated). I'm also assuming that because the two alternatives end with exactly the same result that it is only necessary to actually roll (or require your opponent to roll) if one of you is being pedantic.

          Would those be valid assumptions?

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          • #6
            The point of the comment made by Daedle is : You can roll dice or save time and not roll dice but, the result is... the model passes the check no matter the roll made and the iron resolve mechanic then kicks in.

            Truth be told this rule only seems to be in effect when a fearless model has the iron reslove rule. Other wise I myself have never understood why anyone would even bother to make the check. I mean sure yah its a dice game and we love to roll dice, but in a fast paced setting why roll if you know nothing can come of it? It is of the same line of logic of when a unit is so doomed that the other player will just ask you to "double 1 it". IE unless you love to roll dice all the time why bother rolling when it serves no purpose?

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            • #7
              So it is the politeness factor. As long as your opponent isn't a $%^&* its all good. Makes sense. Thanks.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by fon52 View Post
                So it is the politeness factor. As long as your opponent isn't a $%^&* its all good. Makes sense. Thanks.
                My question was in regards specifically to the Iron Resolve rule on fearless models to be honest. I'm not sure if any other rule would apply off the top of my head but wanted to clear it up just in case anyone could think of any others. But yeah, we don't bother with pointless rolls... Unless it's a tournament setting on the clock I guess and you are wanting your opponent to take up as much time as possible rolling dice and less time scheming!

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                • #9
                  Fearless models are not affected by the 12 rule, so as long as the nerve test is mathematically impossible to fail they are always getting Iron Resolve. The roll is theoretically required, but its pure formality at that point. It comes up a lot in the various beatings my wife dishes out to me with her Basilea army....

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Geist View Post
                    It is of the same line of logic of when a unit is so doomed that the other player will just ask you to "double 1 it".
                    Please, please can we have pictures whenever this happens?
                    I will be doing so...

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                    • #11
                      You dont really need a picture. The most basic example is if a Legion flank charges a troop. Its pretty much a done deal.

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                      • #12
                        It is kind of like in match play in golf when a ball is less than a foot (say an inch) from the hole, the opponent will sometimes simply says to pick it up, even though a mishit could theoretically occur it is so rare no one bothers. Except in this case, we know that the issue is either double 1's when the odds of killing the unit down to zero are that greater and there is no heal or regen option or double 6's when there is no hope of wounding even to rout and one is on the last turn or not bothering to roll for rout or waiver on a fearless unit with not enough damage to rout. Why bother making someone roll all the dice to wound and damage when it is obvious or rolling to rout when it is obvious?

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                        • #13
                          I agree with the premise, I was just overly fond of the "When something is so doomed..." statement and wanted to see how many different situational 'Dooooomed!' moments we could capture...
                          Like Dice shaming moments.

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                          • #14
                            I don't like the "just double 1 it" thing. When it's been suggested to me and I've actually looked at the numbers, I've noticed that there was always a higher chance of scoring less wounds than would be required to take the nerve test to snake eyes than the 1 in 36 chance of actually rolling double 1s. Following the logic behind this, you might as well not bother making the nerve check at all and just remove the unit, since leaving the tested unit with just a single wound less than needed for snake eyes doubles the odds of it surviving and impacting the game. I can't think of a combat roll in KoW that's so complex and time consuming that it isn't worth just making it and seeing how it falls.

                            If you "just double 1 it" and get the double 1, chances are decent that you'll want to know how much damage was done, especially with stuff like lifeleech, heal and bloodboil in the mix. If there's any possibility of a roll having an impact on the game, I want it to be made, otherwise you're just robbing yourself of the chance to see those crazy, improbable situations where a troop of peasants actually does hold up a horde of flanking heavy knights, and those moments are one of the best things about wargaming.

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                            • #15
                              ^^ I agree. Obviously the more attacks you have, the more likely it is you do double-1 damage, but you'd be surprised how often people just cut the roll, or think they should cut to the roll, when there's actually a really good chance that someone will fail to do enough damage for it. Sometimes you only need to do a single point of damage and tap the unit and that's fair enough (but in clock games you should still roll out your dice).

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