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  • Not on 25 attacks it doesn't. And it's elite plus vicious, gives a full third more damage when you really need it.

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    • So with the new FAQ http://www.manticgames.com/SiteData/...ta-and-FAQ.pdf
      Tortured souls must me modeled as an infantry swarm with at least 12 models needed to represent a Horde for organised play

      Bet thats gonna bite a few people in the bum!
      Its certainly given me a headache as UK Clash of Kings is less than 2 weeks & it seems I can no longer use my current units :/

      Play KoW in Oxford, UK @ http://www.OxfordGamingClub.co.uk

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      • Originally posted by frosty View Post
        So with the new FAQ http://www.manticgames.com/SiteData/...ta-and-FAQ.pdf
        Tortured souls must me modeled as an infantry swarm with at least 12 models needed to represent a Horde for organised play

        Bet thats gonna bite a few people in the bum!
        Its certainly given me a headache as UK Clash of Kings is less than 2 weeks & it seems I can no longer use my current units :/
        Well, it seems to me they might still be allowed as a proxy if they're sufficiently representative. TO discretion I suppose, which is potentially a nuisance.

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        • I use 5 Reaper Bones ghosts for a horde of Tortured Souls. The sixth space is for a wound marker. If people don't want to play against me they don't have to. This is the first time Mantic have mentioned these restrictions, and I don't think I am in a position to change my army now. I don't go to tournaments, so it doesn't matter.

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          • Originally posted by Peter Cooper View Post
            I don't go to tournaments
            is that because you're a cat?

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            • Originally posted by The_Bag View Post

              is that because you're a cat?
              Me? How? (with a silent 'H')

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              • Originally posted by Peter Cooper View Post

                Me? How? (with a silent 'H')
                Hahaha with haitches pronounced

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                • Originally posted by frosty View Post
                  Tortured souls must me modeled as an infantry swarm with at least 12 models needed to represent a Horde for organised play
                  *raises an eyebrow*

                  Wait, Tortured Souls are being considered a swarm? But they have almost nothing in common with all of those other swarms (irregular, height 0, low cost and junk stats), save for base size, and Abyssals already have a proper swarm! Why does this 'rule' exist except to invalidate peoples' models, precisely what the RC have avoided doing time and again?*

                  I'm actually kind of stunned here, and am pretty sure I'm going to carry on with the (sweet as hell) models I've bought to represent allied t-souls in my Trident army, even if they are far from swarms, instead being height 2 flying gribblies with significant crushing power.

                  *Conspiracy Mode: This decree is intended to line more t-souls up with the Mantic vision of them (and ideally Mantic's models for them), which IMO has never made any sense to me and I believe was a misstep ...
                  BLOODFIRE :: Salamander Battle Reports
                  NURGLEKIN :: Ratkin Battle Reports
                  INSTAGRAM :: boss_salvage

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                  • Originally posted by Boss Salvage View Post
                    *raises an eyebrow*
                    (....)! Why does this 'rule' exist except to invalidate peoples' models, precisely what the RC have avoided doing time and again?*
                    Agree. But then again, the FAQ makes a provision for "larger than average" models, so I'd bet you are good.

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                    • Right, volume and all that. It just seems very strange that t-souls were included in this list at all, unless the FAQ entry was written with the official models in mind and the intent of being helpful, and I'm just leaping to conclusions that t-soul / allied haters will use this as a justification to invalidate some people's models. Note: I actually quite dislike allies, but I wholeheartedly believe in modeling freedom.

                      Anyway, I think I was being paranoid and the KOW community is in fact still awesome. Just bizarre to group t-souls in with what I previously held to be a very distinct group of swarm type units.
                      BLOODFIRE :: Salamander Battle Reports
                      NURGLEKIN :: Ratkin Battle Reports
                      INSTAGRAM :: boss_salvage

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                      • It's literally what the models are depicted as on the box...

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                        • I was gonna say... I thought it was always fairly open knowledge that TS are supposed to be a swarm unit?

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                          • Originally posted by TarcMaylor View Post
                            I was gonna say... I thought it was always fairly open knowledge that TS are supposed to be a swarm unit?
                            From what I understand, Tortured Souls were originally meant to be height 1, and they only remained at height 2 due to an oversight when 2nd edition was released. It was never errata'd because there were no models for them at the time and it was deemed that they were still balanced at height 2. I'm assuming that Mantic were already some where down the line with the official models before this happened and decided just to go with the models they had developed.

                            All of the models that people are currently using are fine because it falls under the proxy model exemption in the MMC rules. So long as it fills an equivalent volume and its obvious what its meant to represent, you'll be fine.
                            Elliot M

                            "There you go again, cheating by using the rules correctly!"

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                            • It's literally what the models are depicted as on the box...
                              I was gonna say... I thought it was always fairly open knowledge that TS are supposed to be a swarm unit?
                              I built my TSouls before Mantic released the models... I only had the rules entry to go on (Height 2 large Inf with CS2)
                              I somehow managed not to guess Mantics Intention for an infantry swarm (with no wings)
                              & made a unit of beefy large models with wings.

                              Not a dig at either poster I have quoted.. Just an explanation of my confusion with the rules & Mantics models
                              I know how internet posts can be taken the wrong way when read
                              Last edited by frosty; 13-10-2017, 11:25 AM.
                              Play KoW in Oxford, UK @ http://www.OxfordGamingClub.co.uk

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                              • I have to agree with frosty. Mine are floating, not winged (shambling flyers) and height 2 - a reasonable interpretation of the rulebook's entry, put together before Mantic released their models.

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